Untied States of Hodgepodges, Mishmashes, and Miscellanies

The ever ridiculous Sarah Palin, and other less nutty individuals, like to argue that the Founding Fathers goal was to form a Christian nation when they signed the Constitution. Today we have lost sight of that ideal, and according to supporters of christiannation.org this country must return to our religious roots.

The evidence that the United States is a Christian nation is razor thin. I much prefer the melting pot cliche. We are the Untied States of hodgepodges, mishmashes, and miscellanies. 

Stephen Colbert

Christianity is a huge influence throughout the history of the United States. However, it's hardly the sole driving factor for any action or event. Economic opportunity, for example, has tremendous influence throughout our nations history. People didn't go west to find God (well maybe the Mormons did). They went to find a lively hood that could support themselves and raise a family.

Also, Christians are not the only religious group in this great nation. Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, Muslims, Star Wars nerds, and more all worship in their own way; often with less violence than other nations. To ignore this diversity is unacceptable. It's a part of our country, and it's not going anywhere.

A number of the Founders were Deist. They believed in a God, but had a hard time with pre-destination and religious organizations. This doesn't mean that there were no religious individuals at this time; there were plenty. But for the first time in western history there were people predominately using science to explain the world around them. This Era of Enlightenment had a huge impact on many of the Founding Fathers and the formation of the Constitution.


Below are a list of quotes from some of our famous Founders. I believe they denote skepticism of religious influences in government. The quotes also indicate an acute awareness of the churches bloody history. They give a clear indication that a number of the Founding Fathers were not attempting to form a nation based on any religion. 


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Franklin:

"Lighthouses are more helpful than churches." -in Poor Richard's Almanac

"The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." -in Poor Richard's Almanac"

"When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself so that its professors are obliged to call for the help of the civil power, 'tis a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one."

"I looked around for God's judgments, but saw no signs of them."

"In the affairs of the world, men are saved not by faith, but by the lack of it."

Madison: 

"It may not be easy, in every possible case, to trace the line of separation between the rights of religion and the Civil authority with such distinctness as to avoid collisions and doubts on unessential points.  The tendency to unsurpastion on one side or the other, or to a corrupting coalition or alliance between them, will be best guarded agst. by an entire abstinence of the Gov't from interfence in any way whatsoever, beyond the necessity of preserving public order, and protecting each sect agst. trespasses on its legal rights by others." -James Madison, "James Madison on Religious Liberty", edited by Robert S. Alley, ISBN 0-8975-298-X. pp. 237-238 .

"What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society?  In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people.  Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries.  A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not." - "A Memorial and Remonstrance", 1785

Adams:

"As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation.  But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?"      -letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816

"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved-- the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!" -letter to Thomas Jefferson

". . . Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or mystery, and which are destined to spread over the northern part of that whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favor of the rights of mankind."

Washington:

"Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause.  Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by the difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be depreciated.  I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society." - letter to Edward Newenham, 1792

"Gouverneur Morris had often told me that General Washington believed no more of that system (Christianity) than did he himself." -Thomas Jefferson, in his private journal, Feb. 1800

Historian Barry Schwartz writes: "George Washington's practice of Christianity was limited and superficial because he was not himself a Christian...  He repeatedly declined the church's sacraments.  Never did he take communion, and when his wife, Martha, did, he waited for her outside the sanctuary...  Even on his deathbed, Washington asked for no ritual, uttered no prayer to Christ, and expressed no wish to be attended by His representative." [New York Press, 1987, pp. 174-175]

Paine:

"The study of theology, as it stands in the Christian churches, is the study of nothing; it is founded on nothing; it rests on no principles; it proceeds by no authority; it has no data; it can demonstrate nothing; and it admits of no conclusion."

"I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, by the Roman Church, by the Greek Church, by the Turkish Church, by the Protestant Church, nor any Church that I know of. My own mind is my own Church" -The Age of Reason


Jefferson:

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government.  This marks the lowest grade of ignorance, of which their political as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purpose." - to Baron von Humboldt, 1813

"No man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place, or ministry whatsoever."

"Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the Common Law."    -letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, 1814

"Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity.  What has been the effect of coercion?  To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites.  To support roguery and error all over the earth."       - "Notes on Virginia"
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This list shouldn't be considered all encompassing. Our ancestors beliefs and ideals evolved throughout their lifetime. Franklin, for example, gets more religious as he ages (which isn't unheard for any individual). There are also other Founders who wanted a Christian nation, but didn't have enough support to make it so. Palin, and other liked minded people, should recall that even in the beginning we were the Untied States of hodgepodges, mishmashes, and miscellanies. 

Good Stuff

Thought I share a recent Facebook conversation from the other day. Good stuff.

Starts off with me:

I think we are all too complacent--myself included. As outraged as I get at the current state of government (especially in CA and the Federal level) I do not protest. I do not care to loose my job, or possibly go to jail. I have a roof over my head and food in my fridge. My family is safe. I don't want to jeopardize this.

So what do I do? I write to government officials only to receive the standard reply letter. I vote for the same two parties, who's been bickering with each other for decades, hoping that this time around things will be different. Then I act surprised when events continue to move in the same direction they've always gone.

I'm starting to wonder if there is anyway to change this country. Those in power have figured out this game very well. We'd need something unprecedented. Like the entire population of a city or state refusing to pay taxes or to work until their government gets to work. This probably won't happen though because we are all too comfortable and we don't want to make the sacrifices needed for such an act.

The most interesting reply:

Have you looked inside to see what can change?

My reply to the most interesting reply:

Inside myself? I can attempt to be more proactive and less complacent. I can join existing organizations to see if I can make an impact, or even run for office. Josh the lobbyist! 

Inside the system? I can only guess at what needs to be changed. Resources and research would be needed to make a truly informed argument. Of course that won't stop me from typing the rest of this fun rant :)

From my limited perspective I think there is tons of room for improvements in education and infrastructure. The tax code needs an overhaul, and there could be better oversight of government aide programs. The healthcare system is equally expensive and horrendous. I believe everyone should have the right to healthcare, and I'm open to suggestions on how to make that happen.

The defense department needs to stop chasing the imaginary dragon (aka big air/sea war with China), and focus more on projects like AFRICOM and COIN. It also be nice if we stopped propping up dictators/terrorist that eventually come to hate us. Mexico should be our highest priority. Creating a united North American continent would be a historic milestone, and could solve many of our current immigration "issues."

Alternative energy solutions must be explored and executed (Presidents since the dawn of television have been making this empty promise). There are also many environmental issues that could use greater attention. Politicians should wear jackets with patches indicating who's funding their career--like those NASCAR guys. Citizen United is one of the worse Supreme Court decisions in this countries history.

At the state level CA needs to get rid of the way laws are written. Having every law go to vote is bogging down everything. Most voters don't have the smarts to balance their own pocket book let alone balancing one of the worlds largest economies.

Geez I could probably keep going, but I'll stop here. Good questions Mr. Houston. Got me thinking, and I like that. None of these issues are simple, and the solutions are obviously complex. Please don't take any of the above as the right answer. These are only thoughts and opinions from one slightly buzzed man. (I am pretty awesome though.)

A reply to my reply to the most interesting reply:

Perhaps the most sensible reference I can reply with would be Gandhi's famous quote, "Be the change you want to see in the world." Simple, and incredibly useful. 

It's not my desire to change your perspective ... at the very least, I would hope my comment can shed light on the potentials that lie within you and the rest of humanity. Believe it or not, you have more power than you realize. YOU are the one you've been waiting for.

If joining a movement is where you feel your energy would best serve, then my thoughts would say to follow that inclination. The same goes for voting, paying taxes, and doing everything else a sensible citizen of a nation in this world feels obligated to be doing ... but definitely realize that submitting to these issues and giving them power by believing that there is no way out leaves you powerless.

Know your potentials! Know yourself! and also, don't take it all so seriously ;)

I love well thought out mature conversations. A rare gem found in the dung pile that is the internet.